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and now coming to you from an undisclosed location 3 2
1 it's the novas Oro watch trackcast you've got to be
kidding you can't make the stuff up and here we are once more with another

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episode of trackcast Welcome to trackcast number four this time on a very
interesting subject the dogma of no salvation outside the
church extra elesium nulas Solus there is no salvation outside the church this
is the Catholic dogma and not a little amount of controversy has been generated
concerning it in the 20th and 21st centuries what we'd like to do in this
tradcast is not go over various proof texts for this or that thesis but rather
present a well-reasoned summary of the principles involved in this topic to

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help you understand how it all hangs together so expect this presentation to
be quite different from all the other things you've read about this subject
okay this is going to be uh a bit unique so listen closely as we discuss no
salvation outside the church trackcast the Dogma that there is no
salvation outside the Catholic church is obviously a negative statement it tells
us where salvation is not not found namely outside the Catholic
church if we restate the Dogma in positive terms the Dogma is salvation
can be found only inside the Catholic Church okay this is what the the Dogma
says and what the Dogma means if we simply convert it into an affirmative

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statement so no salvation outside the church means salvation only inside the
church now of course by saying that salvation can only be found inside the
Catholic Church we're not saying that being inside the Catholic Church alone
is sufficient for salvation as though all Catholics would necessarily be saved
simply because they're Catholics far from it but we are saying that it is
necessary for salvation okay it's not efficient but it's necessary it's a very
simple distinction uh think of a very uh simple analogy for example in order to
make a cake flour is necessary but it is certainly not sufficient you need a lot
more things than just flow all right so salvation can only be found
inside the Catholic Church meaning we have to be inside the Catholic church at

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the moment of our deaths if we wish to be saved this is indisputable it has
been defined dogmatically many times by the church and dogmas of course mean
exactly what they say but notice that the Dogma does not say no salvation
apart from membership in the church rather the Dogma is no salvation outside
the church and of course the Catholic church in her dogmatic teaching is
extremely precise and careful in her wording so if the church had wanted to
Define instead that there is no salvation apart from membership in the
church then the church would have done that but the church instead chose the
terminology outside the church so it remains to be seen then
what is required what is necessary to be considered inside the church how are we

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inside the church now to answer this question in the obvious way of course is
to say membership right if you're a member of the church then you are inside
the church this much is clear and Pope the 12th in his encyclical mysi corporis
of 1943 defines very clearly what the criteria are for church membership and
they are baptism they are profession of the true
Faith they are not being excluded from the church by legitimate
Authority and they are not being in sism with the church that means refusing
submission to the Roman pontiff or refusing communion with members of the
church who are subject to the Roman pontiff so we know what it takes to be a

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member of the church this has been laid out clearly by the
Pope the question is is there some other way to be inside the church apart from
membership some other way to be inside the church without being a
member and in order to answer this question we only need to consider
another truth that the church teaches dogmatically and that is that the state
of sanctifying grace at the moment of death is not only necessary for
salvation but actually sufficient if we die in the state of
sanctifying grace that means we are Justified before God and through his
goodness and mercy through his grace have a right in that sense to be
admitted to Heaven there may still be required a purgation in the fiery flames

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of purgatory but we are fundamentally pleasing to God and will go to heaven so
let's think about this for a minute and draw the necessary conclusion from these
two very important and fundamental truths number one it is necessary for
salvation to die being inside the Catholic church that is
necessary but we also know that it is sufficient to die in the State of
sanctifying Grace there is only one possible
conclusion as to how to reconcile both of these
statements and that is that he who dies in the State of sanctifying Grace dies
inside the Catholic church that is very important to

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remember if it is possible to be saved by being in the State of sanctifying
Grace at the moment of death and if it is necessary to be saved
to be inside the Catholic church then it follows
necessarily that all those who die in the state of sanctifying grace are also
inside the church now to answer the question
whether it is possible to be inside the Catholic church in some way other than
being a member we have to consider whether it is possible to be in the
State of sanctifying Grace without being a member of the Catholic church if the
answer to that is yes then we know that there is a way to be inside the Catholic
Church other than through membership in the church so here we have to ask what

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produces the state of sanctifying Grace what is it that puts men into the state
of sanctifying grace and according to the teaching of the church there are two
ways that a human being can be put into the State of sanctifying Grace the first
one is the sacrament of baptism we are baptized and cleansed from original sin
and also if we have committed personal sin you know if if if we're baptized
above the Age of Reason then those actual sins those personal sins are
forgiven as well thus we are put into the State of sanctifying Grace by the
sacrament of baptism but according to the teaching of the Catholic Church
there is actually another way in which we can obtain sanctifying Grace and that

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is through perfect Contrition now contrition is sorrow for
sin sorrow for one's sins and Contrition can be either perfect or
imperfect Contrition is said to be imperfect when we are sorry for our sins
through some motive that includes our self-interest for example if we're sorry
for our sins only because we dread going to hell but not because they actually
offend God then we have imperfect Contrition our Contrition is is true and
genuine but the motive the reason why we are contrite is not what it really
ideally ought to be such Contrition suffices for a valid and worthy
reception of the sacrament of baptism and the sacrament of penance but of

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itself it does not suffice to produce in us the state of sanctifying grace for
that perfect Contrition is required now of course a valid Absolution in the
sacrament of confession or Penance also produces the State of sanctifying Grace
but for the purposes of this discussion let's let's just focus on initial
justification okay which as we said is either through the sacrament of baptism
or through perfect contrition if either the sacrament of baptism
cannot be obtained or the person through no fault of his own has no knowledge
that the sacrament of baptism either exists or is
required but just what is perfect Contrition the dictionary of dogmatic
theology defines perfect Contrition in the following way quote perfect
Contrition arises in the heart of the sinner who Grieves for his sin in so far

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as it is an offense against God in whom he considers the paternal goodness which
has been ungratefully scorned moved therefore by a pure love called
benevolence or charity the penitent as it were breaks his heart to bits under
the blows of Sorrow when the name of Contrition a quasi crushing into bits of
the penitent heart with such repentance all permeated with the Flames of Charity
there always goes hand inand given the intention of confession justification or
the remission of guilt because ubas I EST where there is Charity where
there is love there is God unquote and that was a definition of a perfect
Contrition found in the dictionary of dogmatic theology edited by Petro

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parente Antonio Pani and Salvatore follow which uh we're going to put a
link to on our tradcast homepage for this episode episode number four at trat
cast.org so perfect Contrition is a sorrow for sin out of a
motive of pure love of God we are sorry for our sins because we have offended
God who is perfectly holy and who is perfectly good and has a strict right to
all of our love and veneration and to our obedience and loyalty to our
faithfulness to our love if this is the motive why we are sorry for our sins
then this produces in us the state of sanctifying grace and this is clearly
the teaching of holy mother Church we're not going to get into all the the

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evidence for this now uh because that's simply beyond the scope of what we're
trying to accomplish in this trat cast but this perfect Contrition is obviously
of such a nature that we are firmly resolved never to commit sin again and
to do whatever it takes to please God and whatever it takes to attain our
Salvation so we are embracing in that perfect Contrition the will of God we we
are firmly resolved to do his will whatever it may be and that includes of
course in so far as it is known the intention to make a good confession at
the next possible opportunity or if one is not yet
baptized to receive the sacrament of baptism again in so far as one is aware

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that there is a sacrament of baptism and in so far as one is aware
that one must in fact receive it of course perfect Contrition is Possible
only with the help of God's grace but here we're talking about actual Grace
Grace that is given by God to move and enable the soul to accomplish a salutary
act that is an act that has Supernatural Merit so we're not saying that perfect
Contrition can be had apart from God's grace in fact the Council of Trent in
its cannons on justification Canon 3 says the following quote if anyone shall
say that without the anticipatory inspiration of the Holy Spirit and
without his assistance man can believe hope and love or be repentant as he

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ought so that the grace of justification may be conferred upon him let him be
anathema unquote and that's uh denzinger 813 we link that also on our tradcast
homepage so don't misunderstand we're not saying that justification can be had
apart from the grace of God and of course the Catholic Church could never
teach such an abominable heresy so now that we've seen what it
takes to attain the state of sanctifying Grace in The Soul we need to also
briefly consider how sanctifying Grace is lost and that is in only one way
through committing mortal sin that is the only way in which we can lose the
state of sanctifying grace and this is very important in specifically with
regard to the question of no salvation outside the church the the necessity to

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to be inside the church at the moment of death to be saved and also the
sufficiency of being in the State of Grace at the moment of death and we'll
see this as we continue with our analysis so let's go ahead and apply
what we just learned about the State of sanctifying Grace about baptism about
perfect Contrition and mortal sin let's apply that to the question question at
hand which is is it possible to be in the State of sanctifying Grace without
being a member of the church now those who do not profess the
true faith can be divided into two classes those who even though they do
not profess the true Faith nevertheless possess a valid baptism and those who do
not those who possess a valid baptism if they were

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baptized as little children before the Age of Reason were certainly Justified
right then and there they Reed the State of sanctifying Grace right at their
baptism now remember the only way that sanctifying Grace can be lost is through
the commission of mortal sin now mortal sin can be against Faith or it can be
against morals but as far as Faith goes the only way for them to lose
sanctifying Grace is if their adherence to heresy is pertinacious if it is
stubborn if it is culpable and if it is knowing that the heresy is in fact
heresy in other words they must commit a mortal sin against Faith but not
everybody who professes a false Faith actually does so knowingly and does so

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deliberately against God's truth knowing that what
God has revealed is in fact different so for example the most common cause is
simply ignorance okay they simply do not
know that what they're professing is not in fact what God has revealed that what
they're professing is not in fact the true faith and they genuinely and
sincerely believe it to be the true faith and that's why they adhere to
it now not all ignorance of of course is
inculpable not all ignorance is actually innocent far from it often times
ignorance is due to negligence to a neglect of of researching the truth of
informing ourselves a neglect of educating ourselves but at the same time
not all ignorance is culpable either so in the case where a baptized person

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professes heresy innocently there is no mortal sin and
therefore the State of sanctifying Grace
is not lost but this proves then that it is possible to be in the State of
sanctifying Grace without being a member of the Catholic church because remember
in order to be a member of the Catholic Church you must profess the true Faith
now in the case of somebody who is not baptized and this justification the
State of sanctifying Grace was not produced by the sacrament of baptism which is
lacking nevertheless this state of sanctifying grace can be produced can be
had through perfect Contrition as we explained earlier this person too can
then retain this state of grace despite the profession of heresy
if again that profession of heresy is innocent and not culpable

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and therefore does not involve a mortal sin against faith and like we said a few
minutes ago we're leaving aside uh mortal sins against morals of course
that's a that's a whole different story so now that we've established that
it is possible to be in the State of Grace without being a member of the
church we must conclude per the doctrine that there is no salvation outside the
church and self ation therefore only inside the church that such people even
though they are not members of the church are nevertheless inside the
church until that is God forbid they lose the State of sanctifying
Grace therefore we have proven that it is possible for someone to be inside the
Catholic Church without actually being a member of the

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church now precisely how such a person can be inside the church that is adhere
to the body of the church this is something that the church has never
definitively settled this is the task of theologians to resolve and uh this was
hotly debated during the first half of the 20th century by Catholic theologians
the church did not resolve this definitively but she did step in on
occasion to correct certain errors and uh this is what we find in Pope High's
the 12's and cyclical mysi corpies for example as well as the holy office
letter suprema hexa that was sent to Archbishop Cushing in 1949 to correct
the errors of father Leonard feni we also find p i 12th speaking
about it in his 1950 in cyclical humani generes for anyone who may be interested

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in finding out how far the theologians got in their discussions and in their
explications of magisterial teaching on these questions there is actually a very
nice uh book out there that pretty much lays out the different positions of the
different theologians and it was published in 1960 so it it really
captures the the status questionis the the state of the question as the
theologians call it the point to which theologians came with their research
when Pas I 12th the last true Pope died the book in question is the necessity of
the church for salvation in selected theological writings of the past Century

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and the author of this book is the Reverend Father John J King and this was
published by the Catholic University of America press in 1960 it uh has an
imprimer of course and the knel opot was given by the famous antim modernist
monsenor Joseph Clifford Fenton so this is an excellent read it is actually a
very long book it uh has 363 pages it is very very hard to obtain
this in paperback as it is of course out of print however the Catholic archive
has made it available in electronic format as a PDF file and uh if you're
not familiar with the Catholic archive check them out they're an excellent
excellent resource for old outof print Catholic Books they they scan in those

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old books from the library and provide them on their website and of course
we're going to have a link to that on the tradcast homepage the website isth
Catholic archive.com the Catholic archive.com it actually requires a
subscription however it is extremely inexpensive and it requires a
subscription payment only once and you will get a lifetime membership a
lifetime subscription to the Catholic archive and they continually update
their content there so uh it is an excellent use of your money
trackcast thus far our little overview of the dogma of no salvation outside the
church and the possibility of being inside the church without being a member

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by the way don't be disturbed by the fact that the church has not yet
definitively settled each and every aspect of these questions it is
important to remember here that we do not have the obligation to figure out
what even theologians could not agree on when the last Pope died okay Our
obligation is simply to adhere to what the church teaches even if we do not ful
understand it even if we think there are some difficulties and this is actually
not at all without precedent um for example to this very day the Catholic
church has still not definitively settled how Grace and Free Will are
reconciled this is something that was debated very hotly in the late Middle

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Ages and after and this debate was uh really severely restricted by Pope Paul
V in the early 17th century you had molinist on the one side and toms on the
other and they were you know yelling and screaming at each other they were uh
calling each other Heretics and the holy sea had to step in and and say stop and
to this day the church permits uh both sides regarding this controversy on Free
Will and Grace and has not definitively decided one way or another so we we just
have to accept especially now that the chair the apostolic chair is vacant we
simply have to accept that we came to a certain point with regard to
understanding that somebody can be inside the church without being a member

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of the church and still even though he does not profess the true Faith be set
to be adhering to the visible body of the church and so how that is reconciled
exactly with the visibility of the church the church has simply not settled
so remember this okay the church doesn't at every stage in her history have a
definitive answer on every question our obligation is to adhere to church
teaching not merely that which is infallible by the way but anything that
the church teaches authoritatively that is Our obligation
and usually any denial of authoritative Church teaching comes with pain of
mortal sin so this is a serious matter this is
not to be taken lightly but it is not incumbent upon us to to figure out

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things that theologians were still discussing and debating under the
pontificate of the last true Pope and with this we'll call it quits
for today this was episode number 004 of trat cast the traditional
catholic podcast produced by novas Ordo watch at novas orow watch.org hope you
found it informative and helpful we will see you again next time
God willing in our next episode stay tuned why don't you subscribe you can

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subscribe at our website trc.com God bless you until next
time it's the no SPO lach trackcast