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and now coming to you from an undisclosed location it's the Novus Ordo
watch trap cast you can't make the stuff up

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welcome everyone to trap cast episode 11 the first one in the new year 2016 and
the first one in season two of our podcast program
2016 promises to be a very interesting year no doubt and it has already started
with fireworks so january sixth was the official
release after two slight delays of what we're calling the big bad book of bunk
the seven hundred page magnum opus of john salsa and robert cisco called true
or false Pope refuting said of a Contessa and other modern errors it

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finally started shipping and of course in the time leading up to it the authors
have been giving a number of interviews to talk about it now make no mistake
about this this book this issue is a big deal for them because in a way the
entire society of st. Pius the tenth stands or falls with the truth or
falsity of set of account ISM and so does the Fatima industry since Francis
replaced Benedict the 16th in the Vatican roughly three years ago they're
recognize and resist position has become
so patently ludicrous and the truth that Jorge bergoglio could not possibly be a
valid Pope so obvious that they've had to fire off such a gigantic salvo
against set of account ISM less their resistance Empire continue to suffer
serious damage and no this is not an exaggeration I mean you're not going to

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invest in researching writing and publishing 700 pages on a topic that is
not that big of a deal to you besides it is the Society's in pies the tenth that
is the publisher of the book right st. Thomas Aquinas seminary press and the
forward was written by none other than the sspx is superior general Bishop
Bernard filet so this is their baby and they will do just about anything to
ensure that this baby will be kept safe and warm and so you can expect them to
throw anything at us that they possibly can so expect this to get ugly not from
our side it won't but from theirs it very well could now while we're going to
have to resist the temptation to respond piece by piece to everything they're
going to throw will respond in full and in depth later

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on we did nonetheless publish an initial response to their accusation that we
were scrambling and providing an irrational response to their coming
tidal wave of a book you can judge that for yourself our rejoinder was nothing
short of devastating and you can read it at the section of our website that is
dedicated to responding to this book at true or false Pope's calm that's plural
true or false Pope's calm we also have our reply linked in the show notes for
this episode and trap cast dot org just look for episode 11 so anyway January
sixth came and the timing for the book could not have been better could not
have been more providential because that
was the very day when the supposed Vicar of Christ released what can rightly be

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called a bomb of apostasy a video trailer in which he announces his prayer
intention for the month of January which
is quote that sincere dialogue among men and women of different faiths may
produce the fruits of peace and justice unquote if you have not seen the video
this is an absolute must see it is a minute and a half in length only and it
shows the apostasy of the man the world believes to be the Pope of the Catholic
Church so yeah Frances really rained on their parade on salsas and Cisco's
parade don't you hate it when that happens I mean here you're trying to
finally publish that big bad reputation of said of account ism right accusing
the people who hold it of heresy and then Jorge comes along on your big day

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and proves beyond the shadow of a doubt that he has no faith that he thinks that
religion is all on opinion and that all religions are
basically equal and while he didn't say that explicitly it is exactly the
message he conveys in that video with unmistakable evidence if you don't
believe me go to the official website and watch the video there it's the Pope
video dot org that's the Pope video dot org and no heresy cannot only be
expressed in words it can also be expressed in images in gestures in signs
and signals and so forth now I know there will be a lot of people listening
right now thinking votes not true but these people are simply misinformed what
I've just said can be verified really in any Catholic theological manual or
treaties before Vatican to that talks in

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sufficient depth about heresy as a crime or heresy as a sin I'm going to quote
only one and that is father Eric F Mackenzie's the delicate of heresy in
its commissioned penalization and absolution page 35 here's what father
McKenzie says quote words are the ordinary but not the only means of
communication complete externalization of thought may exist in signs acts or
omissions hence giovanni peggy rightly states that if a person disbelieves in
the real presence and in token of this disbelief deliberately omits to remove
his hat in a catholic church he has completely expressed his heretical
tenant and has incurred censure unquote which only makes sense if you think

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about it because why should the manifestation of one's denial or doubt
of Catholic dogma be restricted only to written or spoken words why would
actions signs and so on not also qualify if they're clear but anyway
Francis's video promotes horrible indifferent ism inward and an images
which put Buddha the Talmudic chicana the Islamic Allah and our Lord Jesus
Christ all on the same level Francis says in the video quote many think
differently feel differently seeking God
or meeting God in different ways in this crowd in this range of religions there
is only one certainty we have for all we
are all children of God unquote and this is by no means all if you haven't seen

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the video like I said you've got to see it there is no describing how horrific
and blasphemous that video is it's disgusting so you've got to see it for
yourself it sends the unmistakable message that all religions are the same
that all have value that they all lead to God that they are all more or less
good and praiseworthy and that in any case religious truth is not really
certain anyway it's all just a bunch of opinions and the only thing we can
really know for sure is that we're all children of God but that's blasphemy
it's blasphemy and it's all so manifestly against Scripture which
teaches that until we're baptized and original sin has taken away from us we
are accursed we are the children of a cursed race children of unbelief
children of wrath as Ephesians chapter 2 says and even children of the devil so

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to speak as stated by st. John the Apostle in first John 310 and that goes
not just for the unbaptized but also for the baptized who are an unrepentant
mortal sin so this whopper was dropped by Francis on the very day of
publication of the salsa Cisco book against said of account ISM and it could
not have been timed better because nothing says Vicar of Christ
more eloquently than her ethically denying Christ right there in front of a
TV camera with a smile and no don't say now that oh but soon Peter denied Christ
too because st. Peter wasn't Pope yet when he denied Christ and he denied him
by the way quite visibly out of fear not with malice like Jews or like Francis

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you know the difference by the way you know the difference between Francis and
Judas Judas betrayed our Lord for 30 pieces of silver Francis does it for
free that's the difference so anyway st. Peter didn't actually become Pope until
after the resurrection when our Lord told him feed my sheep in John chapter
21 this was explicitly taught by the first Vatican Council and you can verify
this for yourself in den zinger number 18 22 den zinger 1822 you can see the
first Vatican Council teach that very thing and if you don't have a copy of
Denza will provide the link to that in our show notes at trap casts org but now
let's finally get on with what we started entrap cast episode 9 where we

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began to critically dissect the interview with John salsa on the trad
cat night radio show this interview was conducted by Eric gujju ski who as the
Eagle commander believes himself to be the Lord's great gift to the church and
of course salsa is talking about his book true or false Pope and about set of
account ism the interview was released on October 25th 25th and we began with
our critique and trap cast nine so if you haven't listened to that yet please
please do so because there is a lot of information in that and we'd like you to
get the full picture of what salsa is saying and
what our responses now we're only going to respond to the more substantial and
serious points salzer raises against that of account ISM otherwise we would

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never finish okay so we'll pick up at the 3449 minute mark that's 34 minutes
and 49 seconds into the show here is John salsa interestingly the state of
the contests and our Novus Ordo friends they have something in common they air
on the scope of infallibility even though you'll both will say that the
crisis started with Vatican to the major premise is the same what they both say
is that whatever comes from or is approved by the Pope must be true and
good because the Pope is infallible that is the major premise of both one of the
conservative Catholics in the state of the countess seriously not surprisingly
John salsa sets up a straw man here he claims that said of acontece exaggerated
papal infallibility to the extent that everything that comes from the Pope is
infallible when that's obviously not the case now interestingly enough he does

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not provide an example of where said of a contests have claimed that supposedly
right or who like which side of acontece have said that but we'll we'll let that
slide the set of account is position is exactly the position of the catholic
church before vatican to all right whatever comes from the Holy See at
least officially is binding upon the conscience of each Catholic okay it's
not infallible but it is nevertheless binding the refusal to draw that
distinction is one of Saul's us fundamental errors right his argument
implies that unless something comes with the note of infallibility attached we
are not bound in and of itself to ascend to it and this is the error

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this is false there are countless proofs that a Catholic especially the average
Catholic in the pews as opposed to especially trained and commissioned
theologian which by the way John salsa is not is not permitted to descend from
anything the Holy See teaches approves establishes or decrees have a look at
some very unbiased evidence for this the best explanation for the layman is
perhaps found in canon george smith's article published in the 1930s called
must i believe it we have this essay length in our show notes at trap cass
org so you can find it there please take
the time to read it because it is a very well stated explanation of a catholics
duty to submit to the Holy See and the best part about it is that because it
was written in the 1930s it's totally unbiased okay it's untainted if you will

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by the controversy of the present day must I believe it by cannon George Smith
now when we issue our full response to solve this book we will lay out all the
evidence with all the quotations and citations to really prove our point but
we can't do that here because we'd never finish and besides I mean this isn't
supposed to be a complete refutation anyway but just a preliminary critical
response to this one interview but what we will do right now is we will provide
one very clear quote from Pope I as the 12th on this very issue which comes from
his encyclical humani generis published in nineteen fifty and this is very
applicable so please listen closely quote this sacred office of teacher in

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matters of faith and morals must be the proximate and universal criterion of
truth for all theologians since to it has been entrusted by Christ our Lord the
hold a positive faith sacred scripture and divine tradition to be preserved
guarded and interpret it unquote so here Popeyes the 12th is clarifying that the
papal Magisterium the sacred office of teacher he's referring to must be the
proximate and universal criterion of truth for all theologians got that mr.
salsa and if that goes for the theologian who is specially trained and
exceptionally qualified in matters of sacred theology what does that mean for
the layman if even the theologian is not permitted to simply dismiss teaching in
an encyclical or an approved liturgical right or some other people a decree or

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or writing how much less do you think the average layman is allowed to do that
and yet that is the unstated dogma of the recognize and resist position that
you can just essentially ignore contradict or simply junk whatever comes
from the Holy See if you think it doesn't fit the prior teaching that's
exactly what people like John Saul's a Robert Cisco John vineri Michael Matt
and so on do on the habitual basis but it gets better because pies the 12th
isn't done yet he goes on to criticize certain modernist theologians who
believe it or not back in his day we're using the same or at least a very
similar line of argumentation as salsa and his resistance buddies especially
the sspx still used today pie as the 12th says about these dangerous

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theologians quote the Pope's they assert do not wish to pass judgment on what is
a matter of dispute among theologians so recourse must be had to the early
sources and the reason constitutions and decrees of the teaching church must be
explained from the writings of the Ancients unquote sound familiar the objection
that these theologians were making was that well this isn't a definitive or
infallible decision and this is a matter
of dispute among theologians so we don't have to listen to that we'll just stick
with tradition will examine the writings of the Ancients and then we'll just go
with that we'll just set aside the more recent stuff but pies the 12 immediately
rejects this as unacceptable quote although these things seem well said
still they are not free from error it is true that popes generally leave

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theologians free in those matters which are disputed in various ways by men of
very high authority in this field but history teaches that many matters that
formerly were open to discussion no longer now admit of discussion norma's
that be thought that what is expounded in encyclical letters does not of itself
demand consent since in writing such letters the Pope's do not exercise the
supreme power of their teaching authority for these matters are taught
with the ordinary teaching authority of which it is true to say he who here with
you here with me that's a quote from Luke 10 16 and generally what is
expounded and inculcated in encyclical letters already for other reasons a
pertains to Catholic doctrine but if the Supreme Pontiff in their official

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documents purposely passed judgment on a matter up to that time under dispute it
is obvious that that matter according to the mind and will of the same pontiff's
cannot be any longer considered a question open to discussion among
theologians unquote pam pam yes thank you Michael Voris that was Pope Pius the
12th encyclical humani generis 1950 paragraphs 18 19 and 20 we've got that
linked for you so this should be enough but if you would like more evidence for
this position regarding the necessity of each Catholic to adhere to whatever is
officially approved decreed or taught by the Apostolic See we are also providing
for you a link to the excellent essay by Thomas Jaleski if it is in the octopus
delicious sadies it is official teaching that's the title of the essay and in

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this article drew levski extensively quotes Monsignor Joseph Clifford Fenton
on the matter who by the way mr. salsa also knew a little bit about sacred
theology ok so we've got that link for you in the show notes so really the the
issue of infallibility has nothing to do with this this is not about
infallibility it's about authority because we must adhere to what the
Church teaches even if it is not taught infallibly because our obligation to
accept what the church the Holy See teaches legislates approves and acts
determined and so on does not arise from its inability to be false but from the
church's divine Commission and her right to complete obedience of her children
and this is wonderfully explained in the article we mentioned earlier must I

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believe it by Canon Smith one quote from that article and then we'll move on so
this is canon Smith speaking quote herein lies the source of the obligation
to believe what the church teaches the church possesses the divine Commission
to teach and hence there arises in the faithful a moral obligation to believe
which is founded ultimately not upon the infallibility of the church but upon
God's sovereign right to the submission and intellectual allegiance of his
creatures he that believeth shall be saved but he that believeth not shall be
condemned quote from mark 16 16 it is the god-given right of the church
to teach and therefore it is the bounden duty of the faithful to believe the

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infallibility of the Church does not precisely as such render belief
obligatory it renders her teaching divinely credible what makes belief
obligatory is her divine Commission to teach unquote and now back to John salsa
it's funny the Sadie the contests even disagree with each other on why Vatican
2 was infallible some say the contest will say because it was a gathering of
the world's bit ships in union with the Pope it was an exercise of the
extraordinary Magisterium and that's why
everything has to be believed others say to the contest will say no they didn't
issue any extraordinary statements with a note of infallibility but it's
infallible and by the ordinary and universal Magisterium oh look said of a
countess disagree with one another about Vatican 2 yeah like that doesn't happen
and solve this church here you have mr. salsa claiming that Vatican 2 contains

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heresy and other errors which is something absolutely denied for example
by Christopher Ferreira and probably also by most indole clerics who know
that if that were the case their goose would be cooked Ferrara has always hid
himself behind the word novelty he only concedes that Vatican 2 contains
novelties but he refuses to say whether those novelties are true or false
sometimes he'll say that we don't even know what they mean well if we don't
know what they mean then why is he resisting them so vehemently anyway
regarding Vatican to it really doesn't matter if any of it would meet the
criteria of infallibility or not because either way it most certainly could not
have come from a troop hope as it requires allegiance and submission to
its glaring errors in fact each conciliar document was promulgated with

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a special formula which was czyli the following now listen closely
quote each and all these items which are
set forth in this document have met with the approval of the council fathers and
we remember now this is Paul 26 speaking and we buy the apostolic power given us
by Christ together with the venerable fathers in the Holy Spirit approved
decree and establish it and command command that would has thus been decided
in the council be promulgated for the glory of God unquote if Paul the sex was
a true Pope that is what you would have to believe about each of the vatican two
documents does John salsa believe that Chris Ferreira Jonathan re Robert Cisco

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fat chance for a very informative and compelling essay on whether Vatican two
met the criteria for infallibility if we assume Paul the sixth was a true Pope
please see John Daly's sa did Vatican to teach infallibly did Vatican to teach
infallibly by John Daly it's linked on our homepage at trap cast dot org
returning now to John salsa all of a sudden he starts drawing a distinction
between ordinary and extraordinary council council mind you not Magisterium
but council which of course he doesn't try to prove or anything and he couldn't
because he just made it up and then he continues like this so what were left
with is because it's coming from the Magisterium the authentic Magisterium we
give it a religious observance however that is conditional the theologians van

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or brother Barry they all say that this religious ascent number one is not the
ascent of faith it's not in the authority of God revealing it's on the
authority of the church teaching and because the church has not told us that
we must submit to Vatican 2 with the assent of faith we have a
the dis observance which if those teachings are contrary to what the
church is previously defined that must be believed with the assent of faith
then we do not have to adhere to them in
fact we are required than to reject them that's the case with the novelties of
Vatican 2 ah and that ladies and gentlemen is the crux that is the heart
of the matter this last assertion of his he did not and cannot prove let me let
me quote it to you again that these are the words of John salsa quote if those
teachings are contrary to what the church has previously defined that must
be believed with the assent of faith then we do not have to adhere to them in

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fact we are required then to reject them
unquote that ladies and gentlemen is the
unproven and unprovable premise on which hinges the entire recognize and resist
position notice that he does not even attempt to prove it he made it up now
you might think but wait this follows from what he argued before about
infallibility but it does not you see it is one thing to say that the church can
error in a particular matter that is not proposed infallibly it is another thing
though to say that the church can contradict her very own dogmas and then
proposed these contradictions heresy is actually to the faithful for their
submission which each individual believer then needs to be sufficiently
educated about and attentive and smart enough to weed out and reject at the

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peril of his soul that is ludicrous mr. salsa ludicrous you're making the
faithful who are the church taught into a higher authority than the Magisterium
which is the church teaching now just how much this nonsense spouted by salsa
contradicts Catholic teaching you can see in our blog post have the gates of
Hell prevailed and we're linking to that a trap cast dot org there are so many
magisterial teachings on the authority and nature of the Holy See that
contradict with salsa is saying here I don't even know where to start for
example consider this teaching of Pope Leo the 13th from his apostolic letter
Hunnam in greci issued in 1902 quote it meaning the Catholic Church has preached

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the gospel and has defended it at the price of its blood and strong in the
divine assistance and that immortality which have been promised it it makes no
terms with error but remains faithful to the commands which it has received to
carry the doctrine of Jesus Christ to the uttermost limits of the world and to
the end of time and to protect it in its inviolable integrity unquote now
obviously Pope Leo the 13th had never heard of salsas bizarre ideas but you
know what maybe we ought to update Pope Leo 13s teaching in light of John salsas
theology if we did that publio the 13s teaching would sound like this the
church has preached the gospel on some occasions and sometimes a false gospel
and those who defended her teaching at the price of their blood we're only

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dying for her infallible pronouncements since for the others they couldn't be
sure it was even true fickle in the divine assistance and of that
immortality which have been promised it it makes terms with error only sometimes
in which case we are reminded to check with our local tax lawyer or tune in to
EWTN the church often remains faithful to the commands which it has received to
carry the doctrine of Jesus Christ to the uttermost limits of the world and to
the end of time and to protect it up to a point for details check with a society
of sin pi is the 10th or go to John salsa calm
so in other words according to John salsa the church is perfect except when
she's not she teaches the faith except when she doesn't she's reliable in

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defending the faith except when she attacks and threatens it salsa is saying
that our Lord chose for his spouse not an immaculate bride but a harlot who is
faithful only sometimes it's outrageous it's grotesque frankly it's idiotic so
what we have here from mr. salsa deceptively presented to us and the
wrapping paper of eloquent verbiage is the idea that Holy Mother Church can
feed heresy to her children not just error even but heresy through her
Magisterium as long as it's not presented under certain conditions that
would be needed to make it infallible this is outrageous and think about it
how is this all supposed to work anyway you know throughout most of the church's
history each individual believer had no way of knowing all these things that we
know now most couldn't read and those who could didn't exactly have a copy of

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den zinger handy to flip through to determine whether the Holy See was
currently teaching crap I'm sorry to be so blunt about it but that's essentially
what we're being asked to believe hear how the funny thing is that of course
today's den zinger now includes Vatican 2 and the post conciliar you know
suppose at Pope's and just the whole post conciliar Magisterium so so hey
flipping through den zinger even that doesn't work anymore at this point I
guess it's only the special sspx or salsa Cisco approved versions of den
zinger that are acceptable I mean this is comedy our folks this is comedy what
John salsa is putting forth look if a Catholic can no longer rely on Holy
Mother Church to give him sound doctrine infallible or not well then why
in the world should he listened to a tax lawyer from Wisconsin or to the society

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of sin pi is the 10th which we might add operates not simply without the
authorization of the suppose at Holy See but against it as mr. songs have
forgotten that if the Holy See can teach error in non infallible matters so can
the Society of st. Pius the 10th and so can he and anyone else this recognize
and resist position completely distorts and destroys the Catholic understanding
of the papacy and the Magisterium under this bizarre theology the church can no
longer be lovingly trusted like a child has complete confidence and trust and
his mother no now each believer must hold the church suspect in everything
that doesn't meet the requirements for infallibility and must protect himself
so to speak against her very teaching because it might consist of the most

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damnable errors that are a threat to the eternal salvation of one soul so much
for he who here with you here with me according to salsa the Holy See
basically needs a babysitter and I guess he and a few other self-appointed
gatekeepers get to take that role I mean
that's what it comes down to at least in practice these people don't believe in
the papacy they believe whatever they choose whatever they whatever they think
is traditional all the while verbally insisting of course that Frances is Pope
this is not Catholicism this is a mockery in 1853 Pope high as the 9th
taught quote religion itself can never taught her and fall while this chair the

00:37
chair of st. Peter remains intact the chair which rests on the rock which the
proud gates of hell cannot overthrow and in which there is the whole and
perfect solidity of the Christian religion unquote and that's the
encyclical enter multiple each s paragraph 7 Pope Pius the 9th 1853 do
these people believe this or not back in 2013 Jonathan re declared in an article
for the Catholic family news that he would never allow Francis to teach
religion to his children did you get that supposedly Francis is definitely
absolutely The Vicar of Christ whose faith cannot fail and who keeps the
gates of hell from prevailing against the church but he's too much of a danger

00:38
to the faith to teach catechism to the vineri kids get out of here
like I've said the this is comedy comedy hour clearly trap cast well folks we've
come to the end of track cast 11 the first episode in the new year we will
continue very soon with our demolition of the John salsa interview and much
more hey why not subscribe to our podcast on iTunes so you can get it
delivered as soon as it's released every time free of charge also tell your
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exciting blog through RSS or by email Novus Ordo watch dot org Novus Ordo

00:39
watch dot org and trap cast org one final word to John salsa and Robert
Cisco if they think that with this book they've now published true or false Pope
we are now going to cower in fear they are sorely mistaken what their book will
accomplish is not the undoing of said of a ism instead it will elicit the
most comprehensive systematic and well-documented explanation and defense
of the set of acronis position ever produced this is it for today god bless you