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and now coming to you from an undisclosed location it's the novus ordo watch
[Music] you can't make the stuff up [Music]

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welcome everyone you are listening to episode number 31 of trapcast
a highly contagious podcast that is a super spreader of solid orthodox
roman catholic information coming at you
in an easily digestible and entertaining format [Music] at trapcast we unmask
the errors of the novus ordo religion and pseudo traditionalism
and we offer cedevacantism as the only reasonable antidote to the pandemic
of heresy and blasphemy unleashed upon the world since the great reset

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of vatican ii before we begin i'd like to give a special welcome
to all you nicodemus's out there who are
eagerly listening right now while at the same time hoping that no one will ever
find out you're listening to a state of a contest podcast that's okay
welcome to you as well we've got a lot planned for this episode
different things not all just one topic including a fun game that we're gonna
play later on and um as always it will be a lot of
solid catholic information delivered with just a touch
of that humor that is so necessary in our times because there's no reason
why you couldn't combine good information with a little bit of fun right
so yeah you'll definitely want to stick around and listen to this podcast all
the way to the end and hey if there's a topic that doesn't interest you you can

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just skip ahead i won't tell on you okay promise
all right it's always hard to know where to begin such a big podcast but here's
something that was in the novels ordo news recently
that caught my eye on october 4th we read the following headline on crux
being different must never lead to exclusion discrimination pope says
that was the headline on october 4th now you might say okay
what's newsworthy about that francis has been saying that since 2013
so who cares well the reason this caught my eye is
that this story came just three days after france's own new law took effect
that requires all visitors to vatican city to present a so-called green pass

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to be allowed entry which means you have to show proof that you've either been
vaccinated against covet 19 recovered from it recently or you've taken a
particular kind of test showing that you probably don't have it
everyone else you guessed it is excluded marginalized and discriminated
against in a september 29th article for crux reporter ines san martin writes
quote as of october 1st employees who fail to provide one of the
three will be banned from entering their offices and will be considered absent
without cause and without pay according to a decree signed by the
vatican secretary of state italian cardinal pietro paralyn

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the decision announced last week extends to all personnel from cardinals to lay
people head of die casters and the gardeners who work in any vatican offices
the rules include outside collaborators contractors and even delivery personnel
unquote now i find that very interesting for a
church that supposedly doesn't ever want to exclude anyone for any reason
and no discrimination and stuff now keep in mind that they don't ask
people to prove that they're immune to any other contagious diseases right they
also don't require people to be catholic to work there heresy is still permitted
well yeah i mean otherwise they'd have to kick francis out right

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oh but there's another problem here see if this new vatican requirement
we're about ensuring that no one who comes into the city-state is a carrier
of the sars cough ii virus then there would be some logic behind it
however that's manifestly not the case since they will let you in
if you've been what they call fully vaccinated
and yet it is public information now that being fully vaccinated does not
mean that you cannot carry or spread the virus to others nor does it mean that
you can't get the disease so in other words the vatican is happy
to let you in if you have the virus or covet
as long as you can prove that you've been so-called fully vaccinated
so that means that these rules which took effect october 1st do not ensure

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that there is no spread of the sars kof2 virus in the vatican
and yet perfectly healthy people with no symptoms who won't do the green pass
thing are not allowed to work in vatican
city anymore or for the most part aren't even allowed to enter
there are some exceptions but they're just that exceptions
now that is what i would call excluding and marginalizing people
by a man who insists that being different must never lead to exclusion
or discrimination all right enough of that depressing
topic let's move on to some other things an utterly useless new book has just
been published it's called from benedict's peace to france's war
catholics respond to the motu proprio traditions costodes

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on the latin mass it's 406 pages containing 70 essays written by numerous
authors in reaction to france's decree gradually phasing out the traditional
mass in the vatican ii church the editor of the book is peter koizneski
whom by the way we have critiqued quite forcefully on novel's order watch
numerous times not to be confused with peter hoynowski
of the sister lucy truth project now why do i say it's a useless book
well because supposing francis to be the pope for a moment
it simply doesn't matter what these authors think about his liturgical decree
they have no business judging what comes from the holy see
popeyes the 12th said that explicitly in his september 10th 1957 address

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to the general congregation of the society of jesus
he commended the jesuits for not doing what the recognize and resistors are
doing on a daily basis pope pius said quote
let no one take from you the glory of that rectitude in doctrine and fidelity
in obedience due to the vicar of christ among your ranks let there be no room
for that free examination more fitting to the heterodox mentality than to the
pride of the christian and according to which no one hesitates
to summon before the tribunal of his own judgment even those things
which have their origin in the apostolic sea unquote
when francis released his decree traditionis custodes on july 16th of this year

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we immediately provided critical analysis and commentary in tradcast
express episode number 136 and uh in a few blog posts where we also
go through some of the reactions from the semi-tracks
and for those of you who missed that we're putting the most important links
in the show notes for this episode to get to the show notes go to trackcast.org
and scroll down to the trapcast episode list
and click on episode number 31 and on that page you will find them
yeah so aside from the fact that it doesn't matter who disagrees with the
liturgical decisions of the roman pontiff or how many people there are who do
these semi-trads aren't even all that many
i mean considered relative to the entire novus ordo church of
what is it 1.3 billion people or something

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in fact if you look at who the highest ranking clerical contributors are
yes you find some cardinals and bishops but none of them hold any significant
position in the novel's order church to begin with
every single one of them is either retired or has some kind of
inactive or simply insignificant status there is not a single active head of a
diocese among them not one the only two who come close
are athanasius schneider and robert mutzarts who are active in a diocese but
both of them are only auxiliary bishops not ordinaries
so neither of them actually leads a diocese and who are the others let's see
there are the following novels ordo cardinals walter braun mueller retired

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raymond burke retired gerhard mueller retired
robert sarah retired joseph zen retired then there's two archbishops so-called
thomas gullickson and carlo maria vigano but both of them are only non-ceos and
they're retired to boot so they too don't play any active role
in the vatican ii church and and of course vegano has been hiding
in the last what three years so nobody even knows where he is
and that's it okay those are the cardinals and bishops in the new church
who have contributed to that book against traditions custodes all the
other contributors are either lower ranking clerics or laymen
now compare that to the vatican ii church having over 3 000 dioceses and

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roughly 5 000 living novus ordo bishops in other words the resistance against
traditions custodes is comparatively tiny it is no threat to francis
all right another book that was published earlier this year that i'd
like to discuss briefly is the book are canonizations infallible
revisiting a disputed question it too is an anthology of essays by
various recognized and resist writers and it is also edited by peter kwazneski
now this book is a serious academic effort aimed at discovering the truth of
the matter based on its own description it argues both sides of the issue though
it's clear that the overall thesis being put forward is that no

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canonizations are not infallible now the motive behind bringing up this
whole issue in the first place is simple the vatican ii sect which they believe
to be the catholic church has been canonizing some moral scoundrels as saints
how is this possible quite simply it's possible
because the man they believe to be the pope isn't the pope that explains it all
but that is something they refuse to accept or even consider and so they have
to look for another way to explain why someone like antipope paul vi
can be declared a saint now i'm not going to offer a review of
the content of this book here because i haven't studied it
i just want to make some general observations on this topic that i think
are often overlooked let's start by examining what a pope

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actually says when he canonizes someone as a saint
see the funny thing is the vatican ii church has retained the traditional
formula of canonization in other words pope pius xii for instance
used the exact same words when declaring people saints
that francis used for paul vi on october 14th 2018.
now there may be differences in the surrounding rights and definitely in the
process that is used by the vatican to conclude
that someone is a saint but the actual solemn formula that declares the person
to be a canonized saint for the entire church
that formula is still identical to what it was before vatican ii
so here are the words that francis pronounced when he canonized paul vi

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there were other people canonized alongside with him in the same ceremony
and of course he mentions those names too but i'll omit those here because
they're they're not relevant uh to what we're trying to do here's what francis
said quote for the honor of the blessed trinity the
exaltation of the catholic faith and the increase of the christian life
by the authority of our lord jesus christ
and of the holy apostles peter and paul and our own
after due deliberation and frequent prayer for divine assistance
and having sought the counsel of many of our brother bishops
we declare and define blessed paul the sixth and the others to be saints
and we enroll them among the saints decreeing that they are to be venerated
as such by the whole church in the name of the father and of the son

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and of the holy spirit unquote now we've got the source for this linked
in the show notes so you can verify that we're not making this up
folks if words have any meaning and if francis is a true pope then paul vi
is a saint francis declared and defined him to be one
and decreed that he is to be venerated as a saint by the entire church
and he ratified this in the name of the holy trinity
if a peter kwazneski christopher ferreira john lamont athanasius
schneider whoever can just come along and say no he's not

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then what is a papal declaration worth but let's be really generous here and
say okay for the sake of argument let's say that this is not
an infallible declaration let's say this could be wrong and the saint in
question might not actually be a saint okay might not actually be in heaven well
at the very least you would have to concede that even if not infallible
the declaration is nevertheless authoritative
okay that means it binds your conscience right or wrong you must accept
again if we assume that francis is a true pope you must accept that paul vi
is a saint in heaven and is to be venerated as such
that means that even if you have reasons to believe that he is not one

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well your doubts your suspicions have no authority at all
whereas the papal declaration does so your objections don't mean squat
your conscience is bound by the words of the pope and
that's my first observation i think that the question of the infallibility of
canonizations as legitimate as it is in itself
should not be the focal point at the end of the day it's not about infallibility
it's about authority the pope's solemn declaration has authority
your opinion doesn't people keep forgetting or they keep misunderstanding
that the church's authority does not come from her inability to be wrong

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it comes from her divine commission to teach rule and sanctify
which was given to her by jesus christ she is the divinely appointed teacher
and ruler of all catholics when she speaks therefore catholics have a duty to
listen even if what she teaches is not infallible keep in mind that when christ
commissioned the 72 disciples he didn't grant infallibility to them but he did
give them authority saying he that heareth you heareth me
and he that despiseth you despiseth me and he that despises me
despiseth him that sent me that's luke chapter 10 verse 16.
now again don't think i'm making this up in 1935
ken george smith wrote the following in an article for the clergy review called

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must i believe it quote herein lies the source of the obligation
to believe what the church teaches the church possesses the divine
commission to teach and hence their arises in the faithful a moral obligation
to believe which is founded ultimately not upon the infallibility of the church
but upon god's sovereign right to the submission and intellectual allegiance
of his creatures he that believeth shall be saved but he
that believeth not shall be condemned it is the god-given right of the church
to teach and therefore it is the bound duty of the faithful to belief
unquote again that's from father george smith writing in the clergy review in
the 1930s i've put a link to that whole essay in the show notes so you can read

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the entire thing so when the pope issues a solemn judgment
that a man or woman is in heaven then that declaration is binding on
consciences even if it were not infallible it would still be authoritative
remember the pope any true pope possesses the keys to the kingdom of
heaven which christ gave to simon peter after the resurrection and announced in
matthew 16 19 and i will give to thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven and
whatsoever thou shalt bind upon earth it shall be bound also in heaven and
whatsoever thou shalt loose upon earth it shall be loosed also in heaven
so what the pope binds is bound but let's be even more generous

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and say that it's not even binding on anyone that it's simply optional
the canonization of a saint right so that would mean
that you can take it or leave it you can believe that paul vi is a saint
in heaven who is to be venerated by all or that he is not it's up to you
but even in that case the papal judgment would still have to be spiritually safe
to accept in other words precisely because it is
optional it is a legitimate option and that would mean that it is entirely
safe for a catholic to venerate paul vi as a saint in heaven to pray to him
to imitate him and to let his supposedly saintly life be a model for one's own

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that is the absolutely least you would have to grant given his canonization
but the semi-trads can't even grant that much because of course paul vi known
life was far from holy admirable or worthy of veneration or imitation
and that brings me to my second observation it's not about infallibility or even
authority it's about basic credibility a church that can declare as lousy of a
character as paul vi giovanni batista montini to be a saint in heaven
worthy of veneration and imitation is much more than not infallible
or even not authoritative such a church is not even credible
see it's one thing to say that paul vi was declared a saint but he might not be

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in heaven because even though he had outstanding virtue
and led a saintly life for one reason or another that we don't know about he
didn't make it in the end okay that's one thing
it's quite another thing to say that paul the sex was declared a saint but
his life was a monstrous scandal that caused the loss of faith hope and
charity in hundreds of millions of souls by the universal imposition of heresy
blasphemy and untold sacrilege affecting the entire church
for generations to come the former is odd but debatable
the latter is utterly absurd and would render the church much less than not
infallible or not authoritative it would make the catholic church into a cruel

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joke lacking all credibility to be a divine guide for anything
it would simply be laughable to say that a pope can make such a declaration
of sainthood for paul vi and then he was the exact opposite of a saint
and it won't do for people to argue that
a future pope could set the matter right because if such a declaration of
canonization isn't even credible well there's no reason why a future
papal judgment should be credible either much less binding or even infallible
the pope again if we assume francis to be pope for a moment the pope has already
rendered a judgment on paul vi a solemn one right now
and that judgment is that he is to be venerated by the entire church as a

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catholic saint that is the papal judgment
a future papal judgment could not trump this one
since each pope only has exactly as much authority as any other pope
in other words don't fall for this red herring that francis is a true pope but
we have to reject all of his stuff now because
oh a future pope will overturn it all one day if the church can fail now
then she can fail at any other point in history too and there is no reason to
say that she was true in the past and will again be in the future
but as a doctrinal and liturgical trash heap in the meantime
and this once again shows just how important the pope question is

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the integrity of the catholic faith as a whole hinges on it
anyway these are my two observations on the issue of novus ordo canonizations
oh actually one last thing here isn't it ironic that the people who say
that a future pope is going to need to overturn all these
fake post-vatican two saints are the same people who blew a gasket when paul vi
did exactly that well almost he removed saints from the liturgical calendar
he believed couldn't be proven to have existed historically
and if i remember correctly that was saint george and saint philomena
the semi-trads were up in arms about that and now
they're essentially asking for the same thing

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you see the more obvious the apostasy in the vatican ii sect becomes
the more difficult it's getting for these recognize and resist apologists to
come up with argumentation that meets even the criteria of basic
credibility coherence and common sense i mean at some point you just can't keep
this going you just can't defend the idea anymore
that this hellhole of blasphemy and apostasy in vatican city has anything to do
with the roman catholic church of pope pius xii
it's not the same doctrine it's not the same worship
and it's not the same disciplinary laws what is the point of insisting on
francis as a valid pope if you say there are no consequences to his being pope

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right at least no consequences except for the ones you agree with you
know like valid bishop appointments and stuff
in the catholic church the holy see the pope is the final arbiter of anything
touching on faith and morals anything touching on the sacred liturgy
anything touching on ecclesiastical discipline when the pope renders a decision
that's it that decision is legally valid and there is no authority on earth
that can question or overturn it he is the final arbiter
the first vatican council in 1870 states explicitly
quote and since the roman pontiff is at the head of the universal church by the
divine right of apostolic primacy we teach and declare also
that he is the supreme judge of the faithful and that in all cases pertaining to

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ecclesiastical examination recourse can be had to his judgment
moreover that the judgment of the apostolic see whose authority is not surpassed
is to be disclaimed by no one nor is anyone permitted
to pass judgment on its judgment therefore they stray from the straight
path of truth who affirm that it is permitted to appeal from the
judgments of the roman pontiffs to an ecumenical council as to an
authority higher than the roman pontiff unquote that's
from the dogmatic constitution pastor eternos of vatican 1 chapter 3.
you can also find it in denzinger number 1830
and that what i just quoted is precisely
what so many recognize and resist people do not accept especially not the la

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feverists the people of the society of saint pius the tenth founded by
archbishop marcel lefevre the very existence of their apostolate
is based on the refusal to accept the judgment of men they believe to have
been true popes so in their world if the pope renders a
judgment they disagree with well that's just too bad for the pope
they'll do their thing with or without papal approval
this refusal of submission to the roman pontiff has a name in church law and in
the moral law it's called schism and schism puts you outside the catholic
church as pope pius xii made absolutely clear in his encyclical mr chic corporis
paragraph 23 quote not every sin however grave it may be is
such as of its own nature to sever a man from the body of the

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church as does schism or heresy or apostasy unquote now
of course the le feveris and other recognize and resist people
bring up all kinds of arguments or rather excuses for why they are
nevertheless permitted to do what they're doing but that just proves my point
they decide whether what they're doing is legitimate not the pope the man they
believe to be the pope right they are the final arbiter not the vicar of christ
and yes i know they have all sorts of good intentions and they're just trying
to be catholic and doing the best they can yada yada but that's beside the
point the point is that their position is wrong and indefensible
you know the funny thing is that pope pius ix shot down all of such resistance

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arguments in his 1873 encyclical letter quartus supra
which you'll find linked in the show notes that document is little-known but
it reads like a direct condemnation of every sspx argument just about every
sspx argument used to justify their position please
do have a look at it you won't believe how many parallels there are between the
armenian systematics whom pius ix was refuting
and the apologists of the society of saint pius the tenth especially during
the 1980s and 90s now let me give you a good concrete
example of how we see this final arbiter problem in the daily apologetics of
those semi-traditionalists those recognize and resistors
because it happens all the time but i think it often just doesn't get noticed

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so here's an example on august 18 2020 writer chris jackson published a post at
the remnant entitled the true vatican 2 faqs ok faqs meaning frequently asked
questions the true vatican 2 faqs now the background to that is that on
august 7th 2020 the novus ordo auxiliary bishop of los angeles robert barron had
published on his word on fire ministries website some questions and answers on
the second vatican council being a good novus ordo bishop baron of course
defended the council right in line with the novus ordo magisterium
now of course that didn't sit well with recognize and resistors and so jackson
took it upon himself to ask the same questions as baron did but provide his
own alternative answers and those were then published at the remnant now

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never mind that baron is a bishop in the vatican 2 church of which jackson is a
member and he operates baron does he operates his
apostolate with the approval of that same vatican ii church by raising him to
the rank of bishop francis himself obviously endorsed what he's doing
because now he can do it even more effectively because now he can do it
with more authority but never mind the remnant disagrees so
one of their columnists can simply contradict that and that is then the
true view of the second vatican council see that's how it works in resistance
land right and once again the question ultimately is who decides who is the
final arbiter if the remnant really wanted to know
what a catholic can and must think about vatican 2

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they could simply send an inquiry the so-called dubium to the vatican
congregation for the doctrine of the faith and i guarantee you they would be
more than happy to answer their questions and i likewise guarantee
that their answers would be much closer to those provided by robert barron
than to those given by chris jackson of course jackson's answers to the
questions on vatican 2 are entirely one-sided he does quote some putative
authorities but only when and where they support his position
for example jackson quotes archbishop marcello fava a lot
the problem is lefeve wasn't an authority on these matters and his
appeal to him as an authority is disingenuous
the vatican certainly didn't agree with or endorse lefeve's criticism of the
council right and the only reason why jackson considers lefeve an authority to

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begin with is that he agrees with him that's it
would he cite archbishop fev if he didn't agree with him of course not
take another example in one question jackson uses as his
authority then cardinal joseph ratzinger of course only for one particular quote
and it's from an interview to boot not even some official church text and guess
what the rat singer quote jackson presents is
a quote he happens to agree with and that is the only reason he quotes him
and ratzinger said the opposite jackson would be arguing now that that's just
the words of one cardinal in an informal interview and therefore it has no
authority and it's utterly non-binding that's how the game is played
then on the question of the authority of vatican ii jackson does quote the very

00:39
supposed pope who promulgated it paul vi except he quotes him very selectively
and omits those things from paul's words that contradict his position
and then he doesn't even provide the correct reference
i don't think that was intentional i think he was just being sloppy because
ultimately for these people this isn't about paul the sixth actual position on
the council or what their obligation of adherence actually is this is just about
finding this or that proof text in order to defend their position
jackson quotes paul vi as follows quote in view of the pastoral nature of the
council it avoided proclaiming in an extraordinary
manner any dogmas carrying the mark of infallibility unquote
that is correct paul vi did say that but there's something else he said that

00:40
jackson didn't tell you about right after these words paul vi said quote
but it still provided its teaching with the authority of the supreme
ordinary magisterium this ordinary magisterium which is so obviously official
has to be accepted with docility and sincerity by all the faithful in accordance
with the mind of the council on the nature and aims of the individual documents
unquote that's part of the paul vi quote you don't typically hear about from the
recognize and resist people and honestly i think most of them don't
even know that paul vi said this because the quote has long been circulated in
this truncated version and people tend to just copy and paste
mindlessly and never bother to check any sources
and it looks like that's exactly what jackson did as well the quote worked for

00:41
him and that's all that mattered and so he even got the citation wrong
paul vi actually said these words in his general audience of january 12 1966
jackson said it was december 1st 1966 almost a year later
ironically he cites the january 21st 1966 edition as printing the text from
which he's quoting when at the same time he's saying that paul vi didn't speak
these words until 10 and a half months later
why did jackson make that mistake well a quick web search reveals the answer he
simply copied and pasted what raymond toke wrote on his website catholic
apologetics dot info because that website has the exact same
mistake on it verbatim you know this kind of carelessness this
kind of sloppiness makes me really angry because it shows that that these people

00:42
are more interested in scoring a point in in publishing a defense of their
position then in getting the facts right
jackson didn't care enough about this to do any serious research he simply went
on raymond toke's website looked up what it says there about vatican 2 and
blindly copied and pasted raymond toke by the way is now a priest
for the society of senpai's the 10th so he's now father raymond tok uh but that
website has been up for decades and so he put that together long before his
ordination so this is how seriously chris jackson
and the remnant take these matters we're talking about matters of faith hope and
charity here these are matters impacting people's salvation for heaven's sake
and yet they care so little to ensure that what they're saying is actually true
anyway so that was a clear example of selective quoting while omitting the

00:43
full context or while omitting other things paul vi said that contradict the
narrative jackson and the remnant want to convey
yeah see jackson could have quoted from paul the six's allocution of may 24th
1976 for example right in which the fake pope
addresses specifically the claims of archbishop lefeve for example paul vi
said this quote it is even affirmed that the second
vatican council is not binding that the faith would also be in danger
because of the reforms and post-conciliar directives
that one has the duty to disobey in order to preserve certain traditions
what traditions is it for this group here he means
little feverish is it for this group not the pope not the college of bishops not
the ecumenical council to decide which among the innumerable traditions must be

00:44
considered as the norm of faith as you see venerable brothers such an
attitude sets itself up as a judge of that divine will which placed peter and
his lawful successors at the head of the church to confirm the brethren and the
faith and to feed the universal flock and which established him as the
guarantor and custodian of the deposit of faith unquote
so why didn't chris jackson quote that from paul vi
easy because he doesn't agree with it but when you quote as an authority
someone who says something you agree with only because you agree with it
then the authority you're really following is yourself
and that is exactly what the semi-traditionalists
that recognize and resist people are ultimately doing
and that is the essence of private judgment following yourself rather than

00:45
the church see accepting paul vi as a true pope has consequences
now am i saying that they should follow paul the sixth no of course not i am
saying they should draw the only possible and logically consistent and
necessary conclusion that paul vi was not a legitimate pope
what are some other authorities quoted by jackson let's see well
he pulls out the late english writer michael davies
a high school teacher by profession if i recall correctly and also archbishop
carlo maria vigano another non-authority in the new church oh and for one
question he quotes raymond tope directly yep for the question whether parts of
vatican ii's doctrine could be removed or reversed in the future

00:46
because raymond toke is an authority on that right yeah toe quotes ratzinger but
ratzinger's quote doesn't address that besides ratzinger is a modernist
so who cares again the way they proceed is that they
try to find quotes they can use as proof texts for their position
whether or not the person in question actually is a catholic authority
that can pronounce on the matter is completely irrelevant as long as it
makes their position work because they are the final arbiter on all those
questions not the people they insist are the legitimate ecclesiastical hierarchy
when you think about it it is an utter shame how many goodwill people out there
follow these self-appointed recognize and resist writers thinking them to be
beacons of traditional catholicism when they're really just the blind leading

00:47
the blind whose work wittingly or not attacks and repudiates the actual
traditional catholicism as found for example in the papal magisterium before
vatican ii and now it's definitely time for a quick break
lots more to come when we return in a few minutes and we'll finally get to our
fun game that you can participate in don't go
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00:48
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please contact us by emailing info at sushibaymedia.com
that's info at s-u-s-c-i-p-e media dot com [Music]
ignore this podcast at your own risk tradcast is a production of

00:49
novusortowatch.org we watch the vatican 2 church so you don't have to
go to novusardo watch dot org novusortowatch.org and see for yourself
that the vatican ii church is not in fact the catholic church of the ages
[Music] tradcast [Music] all right ladies and gentlemen
thanks for sticking around for another segment of trapcast
the podcast that is not more catholic than the pope

00:50
only more catholic than the anti-pope okay now as promised our fun
game it's a quiz actually and you can participate in it from wherever you are
no matter what you're doing right now just by guessing by thinking by doing
your best to come up with the right answer what can you win absolutely nothing
but it will probably be penance for your ears so there is a spiritual benefit
the name of the quiz is who said it francis or the dalai lama

00:51
all right cue the jingle we created for this who said it [Music]
i know i know this is this is going to be controversial i know some people are
going to be really upset now they're going to object
and say that that's not fair that's way too difficult and
you know granite this is definitely going to be a challenge this is not
going to be an easy quiz so but you know what let's just
go ahead now and start and let's just see how it goes okay i'm going to read
you the first quote now and you tell me if you think
that this is a quote from the supposed pope or from the 14th dalai lama who for
those of you who aren't that familiar with paganism is a buddhist okay

00:52
so quote number one i think we'll do a total of five or so we'll say oh and wait
just to be clear dalai frances is not an acceptable answer okay so you're gonna
have to answer either francis or dalai lama here we go quote one
i call religion an imminent transcendence namely a contradiction
but the true religions are the development of the capacity that humanity has
to transcend itself towards the absolute who said it [Music]
wrong it was pope francis in an interview he gave just before his trip
to sweden in october of 2016. the transcript was published in la

00:53
chivalta catolica and also online and of course we're linking to it
in the show notes okay next one ready here is quote two
what's past is past nothing can change that
but the future can be different if we choose to make it so
we have to cultivate a vision of a happier more peaceful future and make
the effort now to bring it about this is no time for complacency
hope lies in the action we take who said it [Music] wrong it was the dalai lama

00:54
in a tweet sent on october 15 2021 all right let's move on to quote number three
our ancestors viewed the earth as rich and bountiful
which it is but what's more it is our only home we must protect it not only
for ourselves but also for future generations and for the countless
species with which we share the who said it [Music] wrong it was the dalai lama
in his message to the climate conference cop 26 in glasgow on october 31st 2021
all right quote four a constant tension exists between fullness and limitation

00:55
fullness evokes the desire for complete possession while limitation is a wall
set before us broadly speaking time has to do with fullness as an expression of
the horizon which constantly opens before us
while each individual moment has to do with limitation as an expression of
enclosure people live poised between each individual moment
and the greater brighter horizon of the utopian future as the final cause which
draws us to itself who said it [Music] wrong it was the frankster
the so-called pope francis he said this in his apostolic

00:56
exhortation evangelii gaudium released on november 24th
2013 and you can find it there in paragraph number 222.
this is a boatload of fun isn't it i hope you're enjoying this as much as i am
okay one more here is quote five it's a very short one quote five
appearances notwithstanding every person is immensely holy and deserves our love
oh this is difficult who said it [Music] wrong it is pope
francis yes ladies and gentlemen it really was chaos frank

00:57
that is a quote likewise from evangelii gaudium paragraph 274.
you just can't make the stuff up all right so that was five want to do
more let's do let's do one more okay one more just for the fun of it
okay here is quote number six peace in the world depends on peace within
if we have that we'll approach problems in a spirit of dialogue compassion and
respect for the rights of others always a better solution than resorting
to a use of weapons and force external disarmament depends on inner disarmament
who said it [Music] wrong it was the dalai lama in a tweet sent on

00:58
august 16 20 21 look i know this wasn't totally fair but
i think we can all learn something from this fun little exercise namely francis
and the dalai lama are getting harder and harder to tell apart but
at least the dalai lama doesn't claim to be a catholic [Music]
all right before we move forward as francis would say and come to our next
topic i'd like to let everyone know that on october 8th of this year yours truly
gave a presentation at the fatima conference in spokane washington hosted
by the congregation of mary immaculate queen at mount st michaels
the talk was entitled eclipse of the church the case for said of
akantism and the objective was to give a coherent easy-to-follow introduction or

00:59
high-level overview to what has happened to the catholic church and why
this was not a lecture focusing on detailed theological arguments about
said evacuntism but an explanation that looks at the big picture of our
situation and makes sense of it by focusing on the purpose for why christ
became incarnate and founded an indefectable church to begin with not only
as an organized society but as his very own mystical body
in which he is pleased to suffer just as he did in his physical body on earth
one of the benefits of such an approach is that it focuses on what is essential
and avoids a lot of the unnecessary argumentation that people often tend to
get caught up in and so it is really not a polemical talk nor is

01:00
it overly academic i would say it is a very accessible and also edifying
presentation so if you haven't listened to it yet
i've got the link in the show notes again it's called eclipse of the church
the case for set of akantism and it's available in audio and video
and also we have the full transcript available for download which includes
plenty of footnotes with all the documentation you need for the many
quotes used in the lecture all right moving on
i don't know if you've heard about the developments at one peter 5
this past summer but a founder and director steve skojak has resigned and
sold the corporation to crisis magazine so skojak is no longer involved in one
peter 5 and in fact he has tragically become an angry apostate now
who is busy on twitter and on his own personal blog

01:01
explaining to people why he doubts not only the catholic church and the dogma
of original sin but even the existence of an all-good god
it's really utterly frightening and i won't dwell on it here
in fact i won't even link to the stuff he said but i did want to point it out
so that people know what's going on and can pray for him and his family
and as tragic as this is it's not unexpected because you could see this
coming from a mile away okay on april 3rd 2017 skojak had
published an article on one peter 5 entitled stand fast the storm will break
and in it he made the case for what he called a practical state of accountism
and by that he meant that we must recognize francis as the true pope but
act like he isn't now i published a substantial response

01:02
to that on april 25th of that year entitled anything but said of accontism
analysis of a curious phenomenon and in that response which you can find
linked in the show notes for this episode i pointed out that such a state
of affairs in which one denies in practice what one affirms in theory
cannot last long i wrote quote the discrepancy between
one's thoughts and one's actions will quickly resolve itself into either
changing one's actions to align with the thoughts
or changing one's thoughts to correspond with the actions
the cognitive dissonance of a practical set of aquatism will be coming home to
roost unquote and for steve skojak now it has all right so crisis magazine has
taken over one peter 5 and the new editor-in-chief is timothy flanders

01:03
contributing editors include eric sammons peter kwazneski kennedy hall
and others in other words one peter 5 remains firmly in the grip
of the false traditionalists of the recognize and resist position
and so the content seems to be more or less the same as before okay
last big topic for today on july 14th of this year the die hard
novels ordo website where peter is published an article on traditionalism
that merits some discussion it was written by dr pedro gabrielle
and is entitled the modernist root of radical traditionalism now
with a title like that it was sure to get some attention
so let's have a look at it in the article gabrielle argues that

01:04
there is a prevalent attitude among what he calls radical traditionalists
that mirrors the modernist error of religious imminentism
condemned by pope saint pius xi in 1907. now by and large i think the author is
right in his criticism though um i want to make sure or i want to make clear
that the traditionalists he's referring to are those that are in communion with
the vatican ii church like the diocese and indulge people and i think that what
he criticizes can also be found a lot in those traditionalists that
recognize the novus ordo hierarchy as valid and legitimate
but resist it such as the society of saint pius the tenth
and similar resistance groups now i can't rule out of course that the
error gabrielle describes may even be present among some said of a contest

01:05
and if it is it needs to be weeded out because it's a serious matter
so anyway what is this modernist religious imminence or vital imminence
that pope pius x warned against put in simple terms it's basically the idea
that faith and religion have their origin in the personal religious feeling
of each individual believer in the context of pedro gabrielle's
critique he's basically arguing that these traditionalists are basing their
theological position on a subjective experience of the traditional latin mass
and perhaps by extension at least also of other traditional practices
and to make that point he quotes the reverend mark goring a novel sort of

01:06
priest in canada who said on matt frad's pints with aquinas podcast
quote the lord is anointing the traditionalists
when people go to traditional masses they're experiencing god
and they're staying and it's causing them to want to be holy and love jesus
that's the work of the holy spirit unquote
another example gabrielle gives is that of an unnamed commenter on facebook
who counseled a convert to attend the extraordinary form meaning the
traditional latin mass and quote sit back while you feel the holiness coursing
through you unquote indeed this is the kind of talk you
really do hear from a number of these traditionalists who
place so much emphasis on the experience of the sacred liturgy now there's

01:07
nothing wrong of course with having a positive experience at the traditional
mass but that can't be the reason why you go
there that can't be the basis of your theology as a point
and honestly to speak of holiness flowing through you
by experiencing the traditional mass is just nonsense
besides if that's going to be your argument for the traditional mass well
how are you going to counter someone who says that he gets that same holy
experience when practicing yoga so see how dangerous this is
so insofar as pedro gabrielle is criticizing such an attitude i think
he's right on the money he writes quote when the focus of one's
faith becomes the profound religious experience something not unique to

01:08
christianity this is not a far cry from the point where someone might infer that
all existing religions are equally true for otherwise they would not live
unquote again right on the money there is just one problem with
gabrielle's entire argumentation one that completely pulverizes his own position
all this stuff about subjective religious experience as the basis for
faith and religion is what has been preached from the house
tops by the false vatican ii popes and the novels ordo hierarchy as a whole
in fact that is probably why these semi-trads make this argument about
experiencing god at the traditional mass to begin with
because the excessive focus on experience and religious sentiment is
what they were taught in novel sort of catechism

01:09
but more on that in a minute let me quote some more from gabrielle he writes
quote radical traditionalists often say they prefer the extraordinary form
traditional mass because it elicits a more authentic
religious experience in them the corollary is that they will harshly
criticize the ordinary form new mass for failing to produce that same
experience online you can read many testimonies they write about how they
felt the first time they attended the extraordinary form it is not uncommon
for them to express how they felt robbed
of this profound way to connect with the divine
the problem with this kind of reasoning as pies the tenth so rightfully asserts
is that it opens the door to religious indifferentism unquote very

01:10
very very true now of course for a hardcore novel sort of website
like where peter is to complain about religious and differentism is irony on
stilts their fake pope openly teaches that god wills a diversity of religions
and here they're complaining that what some are saying about the traditional
mass could lead to indifferentism i mean hello
i remember when i first went to what i thought was a traditional catholic mass
back in 1998 it was a diocesan indole liturgy
i did not have a good experience at all as far as feelings go i was
shocked i was confused i was put off because it was so different from what
i'd grown up with and i felt pretty much left out
well that's the fruit of years of novel sort of catechesis okay thank you very

01:11
much in any case i am glad now that i didn't have a positive experience because
you don't want to make religious decisions based on subjective experience
you want to make them based on reason and faith
and nevertheless i kept returning to the traditional mass or what i thought was
the traditional mass because i'd been reading about it and i
understood i didn't feel but i understood that it was right and that
the novel sort of mass was at least compromised and inferior but
let's go back for a moment now and look at what pedro gabriel missed in his
critique of this religious sentimentalism this
imminentism that he rightly criticizes let's see how about
paul vi anti-pope giovanni batista montine

01:12
1976 was the year when things got really heated between the vatican and
archbishop lefeve because lefeve was ordaining priests without the necessary
permission of the local bishop and uh even against the express
prohibition of paul vi and so he was placed under suspension that year now
about a month before the forbidden ordinations in his allocution to
cardinals of may 24th 1976 paul vi addressed the controversy with
archbishop lefeve and his followers and said this quote
it is with profound sadness but with paternal hope
that we once more turn to this confrarer of ours to his collaborators and to
those who have let themselves be carried away by them
oh certainly we believe that many of these faithful at least in the beginning

01:13
were in good faith we also understand their sentimental attachment
to habitual forms of worship or of discipline
that for a long time had been for them spiritual support and in which they had
found spiritual sustenance unquote so there is one reference to religious
sentiment then right after the forbidden episcopal
consecrations of archbishop in 1988 it was john paul ii who wrote in his
so-called apostolic letter ecclesia day of july 2nd the following quote to all
those catholic faithful who feel attached to some previous liturgical and
disciplinary forms of the latin tradition
i wish to manifest my will to facilitate their ecclesial communion by means of

01:14
the necessary measures to guarantee respect for their rightful aspirations
unquote and further in the same document quote respect must everywhere be shown
for the feelings of all those who are attached to the latin liturgical tradition
unquote in 2007 the late father anthony chicata god
rest the soul pointed out that the vatican's concessions regarding the
traditional mass were always based on some kind of religious sentiment
the only kind of desire for the traditional mass you were allowed to
have according to the vatican was precisely the subjective preference
based on feelings needs nostalgic attachments yada yada
that pedro gabrielle now scolds the traditionalists in his church for

01:15
here is what father jakarta wrote in response to benedict xvi's moto proprio
samorum pontificum quote with the motu mass
meaning the traditional mass liberated by the motu proprio
with the motu mass the modernists will now co-opt unsuspecting trads
into their own subjectivist program pope saint pius xi condemned modernism
because among other things it spurned dogma and exalted the religious sense of
the individual believer and the vatican pronouncements that
authorize the use of the traditional mass from the 1984 indulge onwards
all do so on the basis of slippery and subjective modernist categories like
different sensibilities feelings legitimate diversity enjoyment

01:16
various charismata cultural expressions attachment etc
ratzinger now repeatedly sounds this theme attachment affection culture
personal familiarity mark of identity dear to them attraction form of
encounter and sacrality which attracts everything is reduced to the subjective
unquote bam that is exactly what happened and it is the vatican's doing
are you listening pedro gabrielle the very religious subjectivism you are
rightly criticizing in certain traditionalists
is the result of the program kicked into gear by the modernist vatican
oh and by the way who's always talking about encounter

01:17
clearly a religious experience as the origin of faith
that's right the frankster his phoniness pope francis for example
on june 25th 2016 when he was visiting armenia francis said during sermon quote
faith is born and reborn from a life-giving encounter with jesus from
experiencing how his mercy illumines every situation in our lives
unquote there you go encounter an experience another example on april 24th 2015
francis said during his daily homily at the vatican guest house
the casa santa marta quote our faith is an encounter with jesus

01:18
this is the foundation of our faith unquote once again a subjective experience
then just the other day october 10th 2021 francis said during the angelus
quote this is the starting point of faith letting oneself be loved by him by he
who is father unquote so here too we're talking about a personal experience
oh and in case you're worried about indifferentism well francis sure isn't
during his general audience of january 22nd 2020 the false pope said quote
ecumenical hospitality implies the desire to know the experience that other
christians have of god and the expectation to receive the spiritual
gifts that stem from it unquote sounds a bit subjective to me there what do you

01:19
think look i could go on and on with more examples because the guy just never
shuts up but i think you get the point it is the
vatican modernists who've been preaching a subjective internal religious
experience as the foundation for faith and religion
that is common novus ordo theology in our day listen to this brief clip of
bishop michael olson of fort worth texas who gives a definition of faith
in a televised program around 2013 that will really freak you out this is
what he says faith begins by a lived experience of god
we articulate that experience as best we can and share it with others who've had
like experiences which we form doctrine we return to
living that faith and then reflect further on it as it grows among people

01:20
now that is pure modernism no wonder francis made this guy a bishop
it fits right in so my piece of advice for dr pedro
gabrielle would be if you're concerned about modernism you may want to turn
your attention to the casa santa marta and the modernist in chief who resides
there who happens to be the head of your religion and all of his lackeys because
your church sir is infested with modernism to put it differently if you're on a
crusade against carnivores don't be looking for who's got a few
pieces of bacon hidden inside a garden salad at the local vegetarians club
while at the same time you're cheering the crowd pigging out at the 99 cents
burger fest at the texas roadhouse [Music] all right it's time to take a look at
the clock here well time flies when you're having fun ladies

01:21
and gentlemen i hope this podcast was enjoyable and informative for you
and although it took you only what an hour and 15 minutes or so to
listen it took countless hours to prepare and produce researching writing
editing and so on it's a lot of work and if you'd like to support this effort
financially you may do so at novoswatch.org
donate and of course you can also find this link in the show notes
novel sorta watch which produces this podcast operates almost entirely on the
kind and generous donations of individuals like you and a big thank you
to all who are already making this work possible or have done so in the past
and i know there are also many who would like to but are not able to and you are
appreciated as well well folks hopefully there will be

01:22
another full-length track cast by the end of december no guarantees because
you never know what happens but it is a possibility
in the meantime if you like this podcast please tell others about it
if you didn't like it please keep it to yourselves

01:23
either way until next time god bless [Music] [Applause] [Music] track cast
[Music] you